J. Phil Thien's Projects

If you are in need of blast gates, I found and purchased eight 6" cast aluminum blast gates ($10.46 ea) from The Blast Gate Company blastgateco dot com.  Their prices are the best I've found anywhere and any size from 2 inch to 10 inch in one inch increments is available.  Larger dia gates are also available but does anyone care :-)

I have no affiliation with this company, I'm just providing a resource for cheap and high quality aluminum blast gates for anyone who may be interested.

Doug 

My Top Hat lift system.

I have included pics of my design and while rather crude and very unattractive it is fully functional.   I designed it to have a 2 ? inch ?throw?, plenty of room to raise the Top Hat and slide out the trash can.

The first pic shows my dust collector on a stand with the Top Hat below and sitting on the Brute trash can.   It is hard to see but there is a center vertical two piece column in the middle front and a two piece vertical column set back several inches on both sides.  These column?s have 10 inch drawer slides mounted in between the two vertical pieces. 

The second pic shows the heart of the lift, a two inch long x ? inch coupler nut that is captive inside the two vertical plywood pieces.  You can see some of the ? inch all thread rod at the bottom of the coupler.  This rod exits at the top as seen in the third pic.  There are two ? inch nuts, one visible and the two nuts were tightened together.

The fourth pic shows a quick socket wrench over the top nut.  The yellow box on the left is the remote control.  Turning the quick wrench raises and lowers the Top Hat.  Picture 5 shows the Top Hat fully lowered.  Pic 6 shows the Top Hat fully raised.

Pic 7 shows the Top Hat about two inches above the trash can.  I can simply pull the trash can out from under the top hat, I love it :-)

The front threaded rod/coupler design was placed toward the front of my Top Hat because of the inlet which is a heavy addition.  I tried to find a good balance point and placement for the two drawer slide vertical slides, one each side.  Before testing I decided the rear of the Top Hat may need a little help so it does not sag when the lift is applied.  I had a couple springs so I attached them to the rear and secured them above on a 2x4 beam.  They are not pictured but I believe they do help keep the Top Hat level when it is lifted.  The springs are not strong enough to prevent the Top Hat from dropping back down onto the trash can. 

I did all of this without written plans.  I just figured out what I wanted to do and implemented the design but not without some problems as is typical of my builds ☺  The thing that impresses me is that it actually works.  Now onto some duct work. 

I hope this idea is useful.

Regards,

Doug Olsen

Thanks, paint is a close match.

Bellmouth purchased here:    http://www.spiralmfg.com/hoodsf.htm

I'm working on a design to lift the Top Hat off the trash can.  It involves drawer slides on the each side and a screw mechanism in the front, the heaviest part of the top hat.  These three things form a triangle attached to the top hat.  It is fun, almost completed and I really don't know if it is going to work well or not.  :-)  If it does, I'll post comments and pics.  Doug

Quote from: phil (admin) on February 20, 2012, 12:02:21 PM
Very nice execution, Doug.

Looking forward to future usage reports.

Thanks Phil,

I don't have the means, in fact I don't have the inclination to do measurement tests of CFM.  It is as it is and I can only hope it is effective.  As near as I can tell the top hat is a success but again, I only tested it with a couple handfuls of sawdust.  I liked the results and thus far have not detected any leaks but the acid test will be when I get it set up on a wheeled cart and run 6 inch flex hose to my compound miter saw and table saw.  Then I'll really know if it is doing the job of separation and not clogging my Wynn nano filter.   I'm optimistic!!

Again, thanks for the "Thien Separator" idea.  Everyone should have one of these :-)

Regards,
Doug

I tried three times to embed the images after text.  I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong so here it is .... not in the order I intended.

*********************************************

First and most importantly I want to thank Phil Thien, Retired2 and Donz.  My completed top hat is an implementation of their ideas and while I had confidence how it would turn out, I really had no idea just how well.  The following pictures and descriptions show how I utilized the ideas.  Being slow and not working with a written plan and layout, it was a challenge for me and it took a couple weeks to finish the job.  Here is what I did.

The top and bottom "sandwich" pieces came first then the baffle.  I decided to route the bottom with a slot that is one inch larger in width than the slot in the baffle which is 1 1/8 inches.  This made the baffle one inch "proud" of the bottom.  Cutting the bottom this way provided added support for the baffle and it is quite solid.  This was Donz's suggestion and I believe Retired2 is considering it. 

I decided to try Retired2's thought about an "eccentric" inlet.  I probably could/should have made it longer but being made out of plywood, weight was a concern so I limited it's length.
The inside dimension (inside the top hat) of the eccentric inlet, where it begins, is a rectangle 6 inches tall by 4 1/2 inches wide and after making the bend it expands to 6 1/4 inches at the inlet outer opening.  The six inch hvac pipe is inserted to the far left so air hits the angled wall as it enters the top hat.   The interior of the top hat is 6 inches high.

Here is a picture of the top hat with the bottom attached.

Here are a couple pictures of the top of the top hat one showing the bell mouth installed, another Retired2 idea.  The bellmouth is 1 ? inches from the underside of the top.

The inside wall is 1/8 inch clear polycarbonate.  it won't shatter and it is easily drilled without cracking.

The completed top hat.  I tested it by feeding a couple handfuls of sawdust etc. into the inlet.  There is about half a teaspoon of dust in the clear bag, the rest is inside the Brute trash can.

Now to build a rolling stand to mount the blower above the top hat.  I have an idea about how to raise the top hat off the Brute trash can to empty the sawdust.  It involves heavy duty drawer slides  :-)

Regards,
Doug Olsen

Quote from: phil (admin) on February 03, 2012, 06:40:39 AM
By "outer perimeter width" do you mean the width of the drop slot, or the width of the section that is sandwiched between the two pieces of MDF?

Any chance you have a picture?  I'm having trouble grasping the area of your concern.

I'm referring to the width of the "ring" sections that are sandwiched between to top and bottom pieces of MDF.  I realized, when awaking in the middle of the night, that the width is too narrow because when I cut the slot it will encroach into the dado cut in the bottom to fit over the can.  I will re-cut the rings so they are 1 5/8 inches wide instead of the 1 1/8 as they are now.  I'll end up with a top hat ID of just over 19", the same as Retired2's.   

Thanks, for trying to understand my problem.  I think the solution is at hand since my subconscious was working on it while I slept :-)
Doug

Quote from: RonS on February 02, 2012, 08:16:48 PM
Doug, The inner diameter of the top hat cannot be any larger than the ID of your collector can, since the ID of the tophat is the outter edge of your thien drop slot. If the ID of your collector can is equal to or greater then 20 1/8" then your retaining rings will be work fine.

Ron

Ron, Thanks for the reply.  I just ran out to measure the ID of my Brute trash can.  It's 20 1/4 inches so from a clearance standpoint the drop slot will be fine.

Regards,'
Doug 

Hi Phil,

Here is the link:     http://www.jpthien.com/smf/index.php?topic=563.0 

Excellent discussion and presentation.  Inspired me :-)

Doug Olsen

I'm following the plans of Retired2 and made a mistake on the "rings" that are sandwiched between the top and the bottom. :-(    I intended to route the rings so that I would have a 19 inch inner diameter for the top hat.

Instead, I routed it a little larger since I was not paying attention.  I wanted to have rings that have an outer perimeter width of 1 5/8 inches but ended up with 1 1/8 inches.  The inner diameter of the top hat will be 20 1/8 inch if I use the "rings" as cut.  I have a 3hp blower and will have a 6 1/2 inch inside height using a bellmouth as Retired2 has implemented.  I'll also have a rectangular inlet about 20 inches long with a round 6 inch transition at the outer end.  The bell mouth top diameter is 5 7/8" to accommodate a six inch diameter x 6 inch long outer pipe extension.

My question is:  Is 20 1/8 inches inner top hat diameter ok given the foregoing parameters described?  I can remake the rings so I end up with a 19 inch inner diameter but I'd rather not if the ones cut will work.  I don't think there will be any structural compromise with the narrower rings but I'm wondering about performance. 

Best Regards,
Doug Olsen

Phil - Thank you very much for your separator idea and the forum.  In a short time I've gained a great deal of knowledge (well except for my question) from many posters.  Thank you all.

I forgot to mention that my dust collector also has a 6 inch intake in the blower housing.  This is another reason I want to adapt this DC with a Thien top hat and 6 inch ducting.  Well actually, 6" flex hose knowing that there is some air flow restriction with flex hose.  This is the best I can do without going full bore on a cyclone.

Doug

Guys,
Thanks for your help.  Since posting I've read a great deal and learned that a top hat is exactly what I need.  In addition to a Wynn 35A filter.   My only issue is that the bag housing has the cone below the inlet.  I'll likely turn it upside down but I wish I had the skill to take the cone off and re-weld it above the inlet.  Upside down requires that I install a 10 inch "tube" in the cone and extend it up into the Wynn filter a little bit.  I guess this is worth it since the dust collector has a 3hp motor. 

Anyway, thanks for the help and thanks to all who post on this forum.  It has enabled me to acquire a considerable amount of know how reading the posts from members of the community.  My heartfelt thanks.

Doug

Thanks, I have been going backwards :-) with research since my post.  I feel I'm getting closer and thus far it looks like I should turn my collector ring upside down so the inlet is under the cone opening.  Then run a pipe thru the cone up into the Wynn Filter.  This does not yet create a Thien separator and I've found some great ideas for that. 

I'm going to jump to page 23 right now, thanks for the tip.

Doug Olsen

I'm new here and have read one or two posts regarding DC's having the inlet above the cone.  Mention has been made of a "tube" as well as "top hat" in the cases where the inlet is above the cone.  Someone has removed the cone itself and turned it upside down, a method I have no capability of doing. 

I have an older two bag tower DC with the inlet above the cone and I want to implement the Thien separator.  One side of the two tower bag set up is not active and I'm only using one side.   I'm confused about how to carry this out and wonder if I would be better off just using a 32 gal trash can, install the separator and hook it up to the DC.  I'm concerned about CFM loss in either case and perplexed about putting the separator in my DC with the cone lower than the inlet.

Given what I've read and the terms used, I am at a loss here and would appreciate any advice.  Thanks